Self Therapy

[nate]

http://www.mnsu.edu/comdis/kuster/TherapyWWW/selftherapy.html

Does this sound good? I think I'm going to try some of these things. If theres anything fishy here though please I'd really like to know. Also since this really is my first formal and voluntary speech therapy:

1. Has anybody here tried it, or anything similar?

2. What were the hard bits?

3. What was the succes rate for you or how much did you improve?

4. Do you know of any other self therapies that might work?

5. Any advice you think might do me good.
Ok
Thanks in advance
Nate

-------------------------------------------------
Dont Hate, Appreciate!

[andyr78]

I am going to read this over before I give an opinion on it. I just did a quick skim over parts of it, but I can say that I personally don't like it when someone tells me to just slow down and talk slower.

[happy7117]

personally don't like it when someone tells me to just slow down and talk slower.

I totaly agree. That slow down and talk slower advice does nothing for me. I just feel like saying to that person, "shut up".

There is a way to slow down and talk slower, but it can only be acheived using a device.

A device that let's us hear our own voice a second after we hear it which is what Delayed Auditory Feedback is can slow us down.

Without a device, being told to talk slower is useless.

They should keep that advice to themselves.

[Derek181]

well i can talk slower..... why cant you? if you practice talking slower then you will be able to talk slower. i find too many people on this board and complain about their stutter but dont try and do anything to change it!!!! yah nate try it.... i do my own self therapy too and it works great if you are dedicated and you practice every day... also you got to do transfers.... like say call some random places and use your skills.

[Adrian]

Nate,

This is a very highly regarded book. I have only skimmed it, but I do like what is has to say (in fact, I believe I posted that link here a while back). It is not one of these scam therapies that guarantees fluency, it is sensible advice to make communicating easier such as:

1. talk more deliberately
2. stutter more easily and openly
3. make no effort to hide your stuttering
4. stop all avoidance practices, eliminate your secondary symptoms
5. maintain normal eye contact

I think this would be a good choice for anyone who wants to work on their speech without a therapist.

Adrian

[andrewg818]

Talking slower will help to an extent..but nothing as much as slowing the FIRST word/the onset of speech.
However, most people tell stutterers to "slow down" after the stutterer is already exhibiting signs of trouble. At that point, it's really too late and you and your listener both stand to become frustrated. "Slowing down" is a more effective tool when YOU, the speaker [gently] tell it yourself..BEFORE speaking--and plan to do it ALL OF THE TIME--not just when you feel especially "stutter-y"

[happy7117]

well i can talk slower..... why cant you? if you practice talking slower then you will be able to talk slower. i find too many people on this board and complain about their stutter but dont try and do anything to change it!!!! yah nate try it.... i do my own self therapy too and it works great if you are dedicated and you practice every day... also you got to do transfers.... like say call some random places and use your skills.

Have tried talking slower, but I still stutter greatly.

[happy7117]

However, most people tell stutterers to "slow down" after the stutterer is already exhibiting signs of trouble.

I agree when a stutter has started stuttering, it's sort of useless to say "slow down". When we start stuttering, it's hard to just stop to slow down.

Slowing that first word is more Schwartz stuff. I tried Schwartz technique but it did nothing.

If Schwartz helped you Andy, stick with it and maintain that solid fluency.

But no matter how much a person tries Schwartz, his techniques may not help everyone.

What's worse, I have heard that Schwartz blames the failure on the person because he did not use proper technique.

He fails to realize, and probably refuses to realize his airflow pause technique may not help everyone.

[andrewg818]

Happy:
Many people have a difficult time "getting along" w/ Schwartz---and do not learn well w him. Personally,I went to many airflow people between the ages of 15 and 20--and never made it--and never had success. In retrospect, I understand it now. If that is something you WISH to try--then that is one of the reasons I would invite you to call me--so I can HEAR you try it, HEAR you stutter--and possibly EXPLAIN to you what is happening in a way that no one ever took the time to do before--and show you how it CAN work. It is usually the case, yes, that it is being done wrong--but that is rarely the fault of the student, it is the fault of the teacher. I would be happy to give you a shot at it--but I keep saying "cal lme"--because I can't HEAR you doing it via email--so I can't tell you WHY you're still stuttering--if you call me tryign to use techinque and you STUTTER-- I can take the time--and patiently show you why--and go into detail--and help you get it right..and eventually transfer it to the "real world"

[divisi]

Nate,

This is a very highly regarded book. I have only skimmed it, but I do like what is has to say (in fact, I believe I posted that link here a while back). It is not one of these scam therapies that guarantees fluency, it is sensible advice to make communicating easier such as:

1. talk more deliberately
2. stutter more easily and openly
3. make no effort to hide your stuttering
4. stop all avoidance practices, eliminate your secondary symptoms
5. maintain normal eye contact

I think this would be a good choice for anyone who wants to work on their speech without a therapist.

Adrian

Yes, this book describes a reasonable therapy program. Some authors divide stuttering therapy in two groups: Stuttering modification (making you stutter at acceptable levels), and Fluency Shaping (training your brain for speech). The therapy described in this book belongs to the former, and it uses Van Riper blocks handling techniques.

[nate]

Update
1. I'm trying to talk slower. I dont know if i'm doing it right. I still stammer terribly but slower. I hope thats what they meant(in the book).
2. I got my friend Djibril to help me out. I asked him to mimic me and it was very painful to watch. He did it so well though I almost got angry thinking he might have had some prior practice behind my back.:eek:
3. I've started trying to not force out the first consonant (slow start) and I must say its helped to not get me into those awful plosive blocks. But I still cant figure out how to do that with k and g words.
4. Djibril says that I tend very much to try and speak when breathing in and he doesnt know how I do it. So I'm trying to speak on exhale but all the air comes out before I even start to vocalise. Then I have to breathe in because... well I have to breathe. Cant seem to get that bit right. Especially on the h and w and f and v sounds
5. Secondary behaviours I stopped long ago so no worries there usually. Except I think I still sort of use alot of hand gestures when I talk but that could just be me.
6. I am trying to speak more deliberately and not try to stutter less and if I stutter I try not to bat an eyelid. I'm trying to relax more and let it flow but its taking alot longer than usual and in a kitchen...last night a colleague/friend jokingly asked me why I was stammering so much. I let Djibril answer for me.

I really wonder if its working. I am also beginning to just not be so afraid that I'll stutter and trying not to care so that may be part of what little peace of mind I've had the past 2 days. I think its too soon to tell though.
Still wondering:p
Nate

[andrewg818]

remember, far more important than "talking slowly" is slowing the FIRST syllable by pretending it's the ONLY syllable you are going to say .. like this:

My, name is Andrew
instead of
My name is Andrew

<<this will naturally SLOW it [even when fluent people say one word by itself, they naturally do so more slowly than if they say it as part of a sentence]..

your INTENT needs to be to only say ONE syllable and then say the rest of the sentence an afterthought--and keep that first syllable VERY soft and gentle too

[Derek181]

nate,

it takes a while to really get good at the fluency skills but just keep on trying and you will see results. it took me 6 months of practicing every day for like 45 minutes just to get a reasonable ammount of fluency. i still stutter but its mild now. but yah you have to speak on exhale and just practice breathing techniques all the time..... practice taking a deep unrushed breath wtih your diaphram.... never use your chest and exhale slowly and when you say the word let out a bit of pre voice exhalation and then say the word. it works fantasic if you practice it frequently and use it... its good that you got to the point that you dont care anymore cuz thats when fluency skills are most helpful. but remember just practice it every day... and it will all pay off

[jankren]

Talking slow does help to decrease stuttering greatly. However, the problem is Im just unable to accept the fact that I have speech disorder and when I hear people talk normally and fast around me I get frustrated, jealous and angry at myself.

To be honest Im the kinda person who cant be 'different'. I always want to be like everybody else. So it is tough for me to force myself to control my speech while all the time thinking in my head, "I want to be able to speak like that guy."

[nate]

To be honest Im the kinda person who cant be 'different'. I always want to be like everybody else.

How 'bout u just try to be you mate? To hell with everyone else.
Nate
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Dont hate, Appreciate!

[jankren]

How 'bout u just try to be you mate? To hell with everyone else.
Nate
--------------------------------------------------
Dont hate, Appreciate!
For years I have tried to impose that way of thinking on myself. But its just not that easy yo.

By the way, do you really live in the Sudan?

[Derek181]

well you just gotta think would you rather stutter and not be able to talk or would you rather speak with fluency skills and talk slower

[eva]

the problem is Im just unable to accept the fact that I have speech disorder and when I hear people talk normally and fast around me I get frustrated, jealous and angry at myself.



I used to have same kinds of thoughts. But being angry at myself and getting jealous to others didn't help much, so i don't do that anymore. People are all different, fluent people aren't perfect either. You only stutter, it could be much worse than that. Be proud of who you are.

To be honest Im the kinda person who cant be 'different'. I always want to be like everybody else. So it is tough for me to force myself to control my speech while all the time thinking in my , "I want to be able to speak like that guy."

You do realize that nobody is like everybody else? I know accepting the fact that you stutter isn't easy but what else can you do? Its hard to live with yourself unless you cant accept yourself as the person you are. Accepting it doesnt't mean you're not allowed to want to become fluent. But becoming more fluent is easier, or more comfortable to yourself, if you have positive feelings instead of negative feelings pushing you forward. Two or three years ago i absolutely hated myself because of my stuttering. I cried myself to sleep every night hoping that the next day my stutter would be gone. Well it never did, so i went to see a speech therapist. The therapy didnt really help either, i think now i was too desperate to improve my speech then and couldn't give myself enough time to practise. So i gave up the therapy and started to get used to the fact that i stutter. Being different than everybody else has never bothered me, im different than others in many ways and i can only see that as a good thing. So i decided to see my stuttering as a one more thing that makes me different than others, special feature in myself instead of a huge problem. Im still working on that, many times i have to remind myself that its not that awful if i stutter and try to fight against the negative feelings.

I think what nate said is great. Be friends with yourself, and remember that accepting it doesn't mean you have to settle for it. It only will make changing it easier. Never hate yourself or be angry with yourself. Whats the point of being jealous to others? This is who you are, nobody else is like you.
Now that i've taken many steps towards accepting myself, i've started practising to improve my speech again. Without any pressure, this is a little project between me and myself and we'll see how it goes.
Im not desperately trying to become fluent because i want that perfect speech everybody else has or because i hate my stuttering. Im practising so that speaking would be more easier in certain situations, being fluent would be nice but not a necessity.

[nate]

For years I have tried to impose that way of thinking on myself. But its just not that easy yo.

By the way, do you really live in the Sudan?

I feel you bro. I wanted to speak like everyone else too. I hated my stammer so much and I thought I was causing it and there must be something wrong with me.
But there isnt:p Its not something I am, its just something I do.
And yeh I live in NS (New Sudan) in the capital Juba. But I'm really Kenyan.

Nate

[divisi]

nate,

it takes a while to really get good at the fluency skills but just keep on trying and you will see results. it took me 6 months of practicing every day for like 45 minutes just to get a reasonable ammount of fluency. i still stutter but its mild now. but yah you have to speak on exhale and just practice breathing techniques all the time..... practice taking a deep unrushed breath wtih your diaphram.... never use your chest and exhale slowly and when you say the word let out a bit of pre voice exhalation and then say the word. it works fantasic if you practice it frequently and use it... its good that you got to the point that you dont care anymore cuz thats when fluency skills are most helpful. but remember just practice it every day... and it will all pay off
Do you mean the Schwartz technique was successful with you? Btw, would you define your exhalation like if you were smoking while speaking?

[andrewg818]

Passive airflow does not involve any focus on the exhalation nor does it require any unnatural or forced form of exhalation.. The focus is on RESTING before you speak..intending to REST instead of intending to speak.. showing the person to whom you R speaking how well you can rest, relax, etc;--and then, as an afterthougth--begin speaking w/ the "first syllable only" technique described above...
While there R some additional variables and exercises (i.e. nutrition, educating/demonstrating, contracts, systematic desens, toughening, public speaking, b-tub technique, tapes, and more)--- this is the core of the program--for reducing SPEECH tension [the others target what is known as BASE level tension]...
If done correctly, one cannot* stutter even if they want to.. Doing it correctly, however, is often a monumental feat in the face of great anxiety and/or anticipatory stress.. Thus, there are many pitfalls people experience--at which they blame the technique and give up [I was once..no..twice such a person--before "seeing the light"]-- That's why it helps to have a mentor, a coach, a monitor, and a support team--some of whom have "been there, done that" --to help you see what common errors you might be making in technique--and how to correct them.. It is a game that requires much practice, discipline, and a carefully planned series of exercises.. Schwartz himself usually doesn't give anyone much help at all---just instructiosn and a "go do it yourself" mindset--unless you really pursue him--so many people fade away... The TECHNUIQUE itself though--combined w/ ALL of its elements really is virtually foolproof-- but getting it to become somethign you can USE is often a long and emotioanl process--but well worth it.

[Derek181]

i dont know who schwartz is. i took speech therapy and learned a few fluency skills like diaphramic breathing easy onsets continuous phonation light touches. and they all work but it takes practice and you gotta practice them every day. oh and prolongation of the vowels. i dont know how good i would do with andrews technique of saying the first syllabelle thing cuz i tend to also stutter in middle of sentences too.

[nate]

i dont know how good i would do with andrews technique of saying the first syllabelle thing cuz i tend to also stutter in middle of sentences too.

I stutter in the middle too sometimes. Especially on vowels. Last night I was trying to say edible and that didnt work out too well. I started off ok then all of a sudden I hear e-e-e-e-e-e-e... coming out my mouth. I went back to the beginning and tried again like twice. Then I blocked and it took like a minute to just get that shitty word out.

Kak man!

Overall I've been stuttering alot more I think, but blocking less and less which was my main problem.
I hope I'm not swapping one form of dysfluency for another.

Its harder to camouflage the former. At least when I was blocking I could pretend I was looking for the words or thinking. Now its super-obvious! And I'm suddenly getting alot more unwanted comments which don't help much. Like last night one of my housemates said "Why do u do that, stutter like that? You are doing it alot more nowadays." I had this uncontrollable urge to tatoo the link to the book on his forehead!

This is hard. But this is life. And life is hard.
Nate

[andrewg818]

Indeed, much of adult stuttering is midsentence; mine was too. Here is a rough, abbreviated explanation of how this works.

The point at which you block, for this purpose, is caleld your THRESSHOLD.. It is the point in the sentence..at which you lock up--and then perform your own stutter behavior to release the lock [repeition, struggle, avoidance, whatever it is for you--has no impact on this technique]...
When you are not at thresshold, you are perfectly capable of speaking-- just like you do when u R alone in a room--and--for many stutterers--in so many other situations.. When you hit your thresshold, all you can do it struggle/avoid---and thus, stutter.
When you are stuttering--you are reacting to somethign real and physical.. it is NOT in your mind..Whether the brain is the underlying cause..or the vocal cords..or Martians--doesn't matter..at that MOMENT..that ponit when you are stuttering--you are enduring a real, valid physical struggle..
So the name of the game is NOT to hit your thresshold-- to NOT get to that point of locking..

Draw a chart... On the horizontal axis, measure time..throughout a sentence.. on the vertical axis, measure stress from 1-10...and draw a line at 8 --a horizontal line-- 8, is your thresshold for this chart-- it never ever changes..
When you begin a sentence..on some days.. in some situations, you begin at a 5... on other days you begin at a 7... when yer really tense AND thinking about stuttering.. With each syllable in your sentence, tenson rises..until you hit .. 8 ..the thresshold; usually at the word you ANTICIPATE stuttering on [psychological anticipatory stress]....
Since stress rises w/ each syllable in the sentence, if you BEGIN at your base level tenson--the starting tension... it does nto rise fast enough to hit thresshold.. In other words, if the sentence is
MY NAME IS JOHN
and the feared word is JOHN...
and your base level tenson in 7 and your thresshold is 8... and you'rE FEARNG the word "john"--you will BEGNI speaking normally/rapily around 7.5 and hit 8 at "john"
if you have a rest/airflow start---you will begin right at 7 --giving you more room til your thresshold is hit..the slow start will put you at 7.1
as you begin speakng, you will suddenyl "KNOW" that you are notgoing to stutter..and you will literally GLIDE over the feared word you were "sure" you were going to stutter on.. I still remember the FIRST time I was "sure" I was going to stutter and did not --It took a few weeks of trials and tribulatons, heartache, uncertainty, and almsot quitting--but it was AMAZING when it happeend.
Well, im away on a cruise.. im not gonna check again for a week or so-- but I hope I've explained this..and why it works for MIDSENTECNE stuttering--- somewhat clearly..
It's all about how yuo GET SET TO SPEAK --before the beginnign of each new sent.

[JCarver]

April 3, 2008

Fellow Stutterers,
Thank God for this site. A little information about me… I’m 41 and a life- long stutterer. I think that I am a pretty successful (Thank God) business owner. I own a couple different firms. Still, I am terrified to speak although my businesses require it of me. One of my businesses is a Insurance/Financial Planning firm, another a greeting card company while another I have authored a self-help book. I get so frustrated with myself as I wish fluency would, one day, be my friend. Regardless, I push on and you can too. I desire to be an inspiration/encouragement to those who desire it.

A couple ideas, I know those of us who stutter wish they could express themselves without the embarrassment of our speech. I found a way…my greeting card business…it’s awesome. You can try it for free at www.sendoutcards.com/10327 It’s a way for you to express your feelings in a card in a way that just won’t come out your mouth.

Another idea is to read my book. It clearly tells of my struggles and how I was able to deal with them.
http://www.lulu.com/content/2134271 This site is where you can get more information about my book.

Again, my role (here) is not to sell you anything but put tools in your hands to do something regardless of your struggle. You can overcome anything. Let me help!

John Carver
The Carver Group
15 E Main St #223
Westminster, MD 21157
JohnCarver@hughes.net – Email
410-905-8336 - Cell

[nate]

Ok so I have been folowing everyones advice, and I dont know...
This last weekend I was in Kenya (where people have known me longer) and everyone thought I was speaking far worse, they kept asking me whether I was "stressed out over there in the boondocks" and why I didn't come home.
I on the other hand am feeling alot better. I dont get as exhausted trying to talk, and it's just easier to say what I want, somehow I feel like I am not only more coherent, but also I am actually saying what I want to say, and making at least a modicum of sense.
I've never really been able to hide that I have a severe stammer anyway and now even though I think its more overt, I dont think its more obvious.
Maybe I am taking longer to talk, and I do sound a bit strange, but thats because I am actually saying what I want, rather than what's easiest, but its making people uncomfortable or something. Or maybe its just me.
Or maybe I have switched one form of dysfluency for another and I'm not getting anywhere. But I do feel better about my speech and ignoring the comments and maybe thats all I can hope for. Djibril (my friend) says " their life"
This is so weird. Any thoughts???
Nate

[Daniel]

I know nothing about this course.

But my thoughts on slowing down are; People want to stop stuttering to fit in, to sound normal and not to be embarrassed. Well I'd have to ask what's worse stuttering or sounding like you're retarded. Also in my experience when you start slowing down people tend to cut in before you've finished talking. We have a fast paced world it can be hard sometimes to talk slow.

I've found that breathing and relaxing helps, the sky could fall in and I'd be calm and relaxed telling people to run... :D

[Bud]

http://www.mnsu.edu/comdis/kuster/TherapyWWW/selftherapy.html

Does this sound good? I think I'm going to try some of these things. If theres anything fishy here though please I'd really like to know. Also since this really is my first formal and voluntary speech therapy:

1. Has anybody here tried it, or anything similar?

2. What were the hard bits?

3. What was the succes rate for you or how much did you improve?

4. Do you know of any other self therapies that might work?

5. Any advice you think might do me good.
Ok
Thanks in advance
Nate

-------------------------------------------------
Dont Hate, Appreciate!

This is the book that all of the stutterers in my family have used and have had success with. This version is not complete, though. With a hard copy in hand, you have access to the complete book. One uncle who could go to a specialist in stuttering found that she used this book in her sessions. It was his doing so well that gave his brothers the determiation to work through the book and be able to speak better, too. It is not a book to just be read through, though. You have to work on each step thoroughly and continue to use the techniques.

The book is only a few dollars from The Stuttering Foundation of America in their estore at www.stutteringhelp.org. Or, check your library to see if they have a copy.

There is more need for stutterers to have the determination and faith to help themselves than to have thousands of dollars to pay for a "device."

[nate]

Well I'd have to ask what's worse stuttering or sounding like you're retarded.

I always sound retarded:D Anyway I am sort of slowing down but not that slow, I am just avoiding blocks by actuallly stuttering alot apparently. Rather than blocking.
And Bud I live in Sudan, those guys dont ship to Africa, and we dont have a library just yet. However I can probably wrangle a copy using my dexterity as the can do guy. At least I know it works, now the onus is on me.
Nate

[andrewg818]

w. practice, you wont sound anywhere near retarded..check out my videos using technique, if you haven't already-- I defnitely don't sound retarded..
http://andrewgreenstein.com/amccormack/hope.wmv