Lowering Your Dopamine Levels

[Gary1450]

I think it is agreed in the medical that stutterers have high dopmaine levels which leads to more stuttering.

I hate to agree with this because I enjoy coffee which raises dopamine, but nevertheless I'm trying an experiment to lower my own dopamine levels naturally by using amino acids (BCAA's)

If you go to Google or Yahoo type in "BCAA's dopamine." Certain Amino Acids lower dopamine safer than some harsh drugs. I'm trying a large but safe dose of BCAA's every night before bed. I'll keep you guys up to date.

I'll be a human ginny pig for the group to see what happens - if anything.

- Gary :)

[marcopolo]

I have just recently started looking into the effects and ways of lowering dopamine. I would love to learn of your results...

MP

[cotton]

Do you know of any stutterers who tried BCAAs with much success? I may go into that route. I'm also interested about hearing your results.

Manipulating my dopamine levels with Paxil greatly improved my stutter. But it gave me rage and a very bad mood so I had to stop. Soon I'll be on Risperdal, a dopamine antagonist. I'm going to see how this goes. If that doesn't go well I'll try Buspar.

Stuttering's holding me back from doing things to the fullest in life. I'm just so sick and tired. I don't want to grow old and regret the things I could've done.

[marcopolo]

I was also On Paxel but I didn't notice anything. Zoloft actually made me a little worse.

MP

[Gary1450]

I'm on Paxil too which is supposed to make stuttering worse although that has not happened to me.

The BCAA therapy has just started so I haven't noticed anything dramatic yet.

I'm always on the web looking for vitamins or anything that might help stuttering.

I'm not looking for a magic pill, just ways to reduced my stuttering and gain as much fluency as possible.

[cotton]

Paxil makes stuttering worse? I thought it's a stutterer's med because it's a dopamine antagonist. hmm... I tried Zoloft but my speech was the same. I was on Effexor in the past. It worsened my already existing stutter to a point I can't even utter a syllable sometimes. It took months for my body to undo the side effects - and still waiting. terrible terrible.

I myself am looking for that magic pill. I've tried speech therapy techniques which gave me more fluency but everything I say felt too orchestrated and unnatural. I think it masks an underlying problem for my case.

Change of plans. No Risperdal. Going to go on Propranolol.

Has anyone read this article on this one person's success with fluency with meds? It's very fascinating! The Hope Document:
http://www.drugtherapyforstuttering.com/pdf/hopedoc.pdf

He mentions dopamine and also adrenaline. He took Propranolol and Buspar as treatment. Propranolol is a med for high blood pressure and also a beta blocker which helps lower adrenaline, thus also lowering heart rate. It also helps an arhythmic heart. I was born with an arythmic fast beating heart at 95 bpm so maybe the Propranolol will help me. He didn't mention he had a fast heart beat though. He says that it also improved his breathing, a problem that stutterers may have. He takes deeper breaths and is more relaxed. I also have shortness of breath. I'm looking forward to this. I'm going to deposit what little money I have now and give it a shot. Then I'll find a better job if it works out.

[Gary1450]

Thanks for that article!!

Yeah, speech therapist say anti - depressants make stuttering worse.

Of course that's serotonin not dopamine - so I don't know, I'm confused.

[cotton]

YW Gary. Here's another interesting article on studies of drugs used to treat stuttering:

http://members.aol.com/rharkn/page17.htm

[Gary1450]

Thanks again for the article - I've been looking for articles like these without much luck.

I'm on the Inderal (propnanol) now - it helps calm me down but doesn't really help with the stuttering (at least not on the phone).

My main problem is the phone - not talking to people face to face - although I still stutter in each case.

I'm thinking about the Buspar - looks hopeful out of all the things I read so far.

The problem is avoiding the caffeine - I'm the worst caffeine addict you've ever seen. That's why I'm probably not getting the full benefits of the paxil. I know the buspar won't do any good if I'm still drinking the soda and coffee.

[marcopolo]

Thanks for that articles, cotton...

I have read good stuff about beta blockers. Maybe I will try the combination.

I also really need help on the phone more then face to face. I guess it's just that over the phone all you have is your voice and it adds pressure. I have recently started using a DAF software product and has helped me immensely...

MP

[marcopolo]

I'm on Paxil too which is supposed to make stuttering worse although that has not happened to me.

The BCAA therapy has just started so I haven't noticed anything dramatic yet.

I'm always on the web looking for vitamins or anything that might help stuttering.

I'm not looking for a magic pill, just ways to reduced my stuttering and gain as much fluency as possible.


Hi Gary1450...

If you dont mind me asking, what brand of bcaa are you taking and at what dosage are you starting with.

I just ordered Optimum Nutrition BCAA 1000 brand and will join you in testing bcaa's soon.

Good luck..

M

[Gary1450]

What does that DAF software product do? I'll try anything.

[Gary1450]

I'm using the same brand - I usually buy at bodybuilding.com - I'm not a bodybuilder but their prioces are cheap and they ship fast. Vitacost.com is good also but the brands are different and they are slow in shipping.

Basically it's this 3 times a day.

L-Leucine 500 mg
L-Isoleucine 250 mg
L-Valine 250 mg

I might increase the dosage to see what I need.

NOW Nutrition is a good brand also. Either one is good:

http://bodybuilding.com/store/now/bcaa.jpg

http://bodybuilding.com/store/opt/bc.jpg

[marcopolo]

Hi Gary...

Delayed auditory feedback (DAF) delays your voice to your ears a fraction of a second. It give you the illusion that you are talking in unison with another person...

I use a headset with one ear that also has a microphone. this connects to my pc that runs the software and I simply use the phone on the free ear.
here is a link...http://www.artefactsoft.com/daf.htm

I have found a DAF unit called Telephone Fluency System that is made from casa futura. I found a site that sells it for 495. Thinking of getting it because you use both your ears in the delay and can plug it into the phone and hear the callers voice as well while the caller hears no delay...

[marcopolo]

I'm using the same brand - I usually buy at bodybuilding.com - I'm not a bodybuilder but their prioces are cheap and they ship fast. Vitacost.com is good also but the brands are different and they are slow in shipping.

Basically it's this 3 times a day.

L-Leucine 500 mg
L-Isoleucine 250 mg
L-Valine 250 mg

I might increase the dosage to see what I need.

NOW Nutrition is a good brand also. Either one is good:

http://bodybuilding.com/store/now/bcaa.jpg

http://bodybuilding.com/store/opt/bc.jpg

Are you taking 1 pill 3 times a day or 2 pils....?

I just ordered mine...

Thanks

[cotton]

$495 for DAF? Too expensive for simple technology. :( I used to have a broken headset that does just that. This is a good market for any engineer to make a DAF creation at a lower cost. We stutterers will make him/her rich.

Hey guys. Looking forward to hearing about your results. I'll post mine up too. I just ordered Propranolol so I'll be getting it next week. I'll try other things for sure. I'm trying this alone first so I can tell if it's really doing something.

Gary, you said you took Propranolol? Was it for your stuttering or for some other problem? How did you feel on it? How long did you take it? Any changes in breathing? sorry so many questions! :)

[Gary1450]

The Propranolol was used for a speech I had to do back in 2002 when I was attending Arizona State University - it did help with the adrenaline rush and stopped me from panicing which enabled me to focus more on my speech. I was terrified of this speech and searched the internet for anything.

I found that you don't want to take to much because it makes you tired. It slowed my breathing basically becuase it stopped me from panicing. This med is also used in social phobia which I do suffer from to a certain extent. The only bad thing is feeling tired all day after you take it.

It does work for me - not total fluency of course but it does redce my stuttering because I have a tendecy to panic which makes my stuttering worse. The propranolol won't let your body go into panic mode.

I still take it today but only on days I know are going to be bad - meetings at works, certain phone calls, etc...

The amino acids - I'm taking 2 pills 3X's a day. Because I'm using this for reasons other than what the bottle says I might take more. I caution you all to be careful as you experiment with this. I would feel awful if anything happened because you took to much or whatever. I'm willing to try anything - I just don't care.

[marcopolo]

$495 for DAF? Too expensive for simple technology. :( I used to have a broken headset that does just that. This is a good market for any engineer to make a DAF creation at a lower cost. We stutterers will make him/her rich.

Hey guys. Looking forward to hearing about your results. I'll post mine up too. I just ordered Propranolol so I'll be getting it next week. I'll try other things for sure. I'm trying this alone first so I can tell if it's really doing something.

Gary, you said you took Propranolol? Was it for your stuttering or for some other problem? How did you feel on it? How long did you take it? Any changes in breathing? sorry so many questions! :)

I agree..it is expensive... I'm actually bidding on a cheap pocket pc/telephone with mobile windows 2003 so I can test the mobile version of the software I have on my PC.. Will let you guys know it it works while on the phone through the unit.

Looking forward to hear results with Propranolol... Good luck...

[marcopolo]

Has anyone tried zyprexa for long
periods..

I had a court appearence and actually took it for about 4 days prior. I was breaking the pills in 1/2 but it did help. I actually remember one day where I was totaly fluent with no blocks at all. It did however make really tired...I mean Really tired...lol ... I went to sleep early and couldn't wake up in the morning...

[cotton]

Gary thanks for the info and advice on Propranolol. Maybe I should take it occasionally like you. I done some info searching about it and heard about possibility of congestive heart failure and intolerance to the med if taken long term.

I have MVP (mitral valve prolapse) of the heart, a condition in which the body is sensitive to adrenaline so it beats very fast. I read so far that certain people with MVP are prescribed Propranolol to slow down the heart. So maybe after all my stuttering is rooted in my MVP. Hopefully a cure?

MP, I was on Zyprexa for several months. It made me very sleepy too and ate like a pig. Yes I did speak more fluently. My whole body was so relaxed. Too relaxed. My vocal chords also felt loose and speaking felt very natural and normal. That was great and fun to say things that I wanted to say without holding back. I didn't like the fact that I was gaining weight on it even on such a tiny dose, so I quit. I heard some people can gain up to 50 lbs on Zyprexa.

[arney]

hello guys,
please tell me if this drug therapy causes any serious side effects
because i want to try it??
specially Buspar and Paxil

[cotton]

I don't know about Buspar but it sounds more tolerant than Paxil. Everyone has a different reaction to Paxil. For instance, I felt worse emotionally on Paxil but I got rid of my stutter. Some people lose weight, some gain weight. One of its uses is for social anxiety so you may find that being less self conscious of your speaking will improve your stutter, since our anxiety of speaking makes it worse. I felt dissociated, like I was floating outside my body and felt like a puppet on strings, and cared less about what people think. Though strangely I felt very on edge and can have tantrums any minute. You may get a different feeling. There was a lawsuit against the pharma. company that makes Paxil because of the terrible withdrawal symptoms comparable to that of an addict getting off coke. Some people don't have much problems getting off it... depends on the dose, how long you take it, how your body takes it in. You'll need to wean yourself off it with smaller and smaller doses. I'd try the Buspar first.

[happy7117]

I agree with you all the way-- there's so many things I want to do like get a girlfriend- but Im scared of the stuttering aspect to talk to her... and I also want to get promoted in my job- but Im stuck doing the same boring menial tasks every day with no variety because of
the stuttering garbage-- and for god's sake all i need is a device
like DAF or Fluency Master to help me and ill feel way better- but its to much dam money....avoided my school dnaces because of stuttering-- got teased in high school fo the weird facial tics i made that came from stuttering-- I'm 27 and at a stupid standstill..

[happy7117]

I don't know about Buspar but it sounds more tolerant than Paxil. Everyone has a different reaction to Paxil. For instance, I felt worse emotionally on Paxil but I got rid of my stutter. Some people lose weight, some gain weight. One of its uses is for social anxiety so you may find that being less self conscious of your speaking will improve your stutter, since our anxiety of speaking makes it worse. I felt dissociated, like I was floating outside my body and felt like a puppet on strings, and cared less about what people think. Though strangely I felt very on edge and can have tantrums any minute. You may get a different feeling. There was a lawsuit against the pharma. company that makes Paxil because of the terrible withdrawal symptoms comparable to that of an addict getting off coke. Some people don't have much problems getting off it... depends on the dose, how long you take it, how your body takes it in. You'll need to wean yourself off it with smaller and smaller doses. I'd try the Buspar first.


I am currently on Inderal and Effexor-- anyone have
any opinions on them and how they make your stutter less or more--

I wonder if it contributes to my stuttering...if it makes my stutter worse I am definately going off it..
i think it helps with anxiety but it makes me feel
all isolated at work- the employees like
it- but I don't-- there's absolutley no chemistry-
could be that the medicine contributes to
feeling isolated..as well as adding to the stutter thing..

[Flash]

avoided my school dnaces because of stuttering-- got teased in high school fo the weird facial tics i made that came from stuttering

Same thing with me, but all this happened recently, instead of a decade ago, because I just finished high school. Whenever I think about those moments, it makes me so depressed that everyone else did those fun things while I was sitting at home doing nothing.

[happy7117]

It's absolutley the most unfairest thing in the world- it's something we all take for granted..speech--
but for stuttering it's the most unfairest curse ever..
and treatments are a couple thousand bucks---

Yet the anti-stutterer aids are very helpfull but cost
3 thou-- but yet due to money issues most do not have that kind of money-- so we live in shame
and misery with no way out....

And those that do not stutter do not feel
the desperation we feel!!!

Those affllicted with stuttering should have every
possible advantage at their disposal irreguardless of money- without living in despair...

It's been 27 years and to say I'm sick of
stuttering is the biggest understatement ever...

Those devices should be made free for stuttering--
because out of all disabilitys --I think stuttering could be the worst...

Why??-- every disablity out there has help
from reliable aids and support from others..

But with stuttering you get nill because it's
not common.....


I dont know what's up with that $4,000 price tag
on the speecheasy thing-- for those who are very ugly stutterers they would give their left arm to get one...

These aids should be freely dispensed for
the most ugliest stuttering peoples who cannot no longer take it....

Im P_ _sed off-- all i want is a good anti stutter
device- NO CURE but helpful device to
REDUCE the stutter--

To all the makers of these devices--
wake up and feel some dam compassion---

These ignorant mean people are making me
want to hit em- (but then Id get arrested!)

:( :mad: :mad: :mad:

[cotton]

It pisses me off too. There are meds for schizophrenia which affects about 1% of the population but none for stutterers, unheard of by docs unless the stutterer goes out to research and experiment for themselves. If I can pay that much $$ for therapy and devices then I'd say I'm doing pretty well in life.

People have no idea how difficult a life is for a stutterer. People say it's not that bad, eventually I'll get the words out when I stutter so it's "not a big deal". It is a VERY big deal to me and to a lot of stutterers because do this chronically everyday for the rest of your life the stress of the act of stuttering just adds up. There is a study on rejection -- how it can lower your IQ and performance. Many of us can't afford speech therapy and these devices because of job issues and stuttering.

$4000 is way too much for a device like this. It's not NASA. I think it's a very profitable market for any inventor who wants to compete with the current devices.

I'm the same age you are, happy. I heard a few stutterers who conquered their stutter say they wished they've done it when they were young. NOW is the time to change things. Think of all those things you can do, could've done, will do. You have only one life to live. Not all hope is lost. There are other kinds of therapy that is affordable like medication. I buy my medications online for less than $50. I think you should try it out. Did you read the Hope Document? It sounds very promising.

Yeah I know what you mean. I'm surprised working with stutterers, the sellers didn't see into their pain... and still charge that much? lol not a bad idea. If you want a speech easy then you'll have to beat it out of them. :)

[happy7117]

I'm sure if sellers saw into the pain prices wuld be greatly reduced--
and for someone to say it's not that bad and the words ill finaly come
out, that's sort of demeaning(if that's the right word)--even if the
word comes out after multiple tries it will most likely be all
stuttered anyway...

And it makes me uneasy when
I start stuttering for people that "patiently wait"
for me to get one word or phrase out- when
normally it would take a few seconds for
the average speaker...it's said people
should wait for stutterers to finish their thoughts--
but the point is that most people do not
have the patience and will not wait--

[COLOR=DarkGreen][SIZE=5][SIZE=4]And even I get very impatient] And even I get very impatient] And even I get very impatient] at my own stuttering]people enjoy listening to clear people-- but for the stuttering person it's nothing but a strain for the listener...even as I am
stuttering I can also sense they don't like waiting for for me to
struggle on the simplest words...

[cotton]

For a instant gratification, everything speedy society like us ... yeah I agree.. patience is... um a skill? I met a group of stutterers who were all very interesting people -- more interesting than the fluent people I met in everyday life. BUT I must admit talking to a stutterer made ME feel uncomfortable because you have to pretend to be patient and concentrate more on what they're saying before you lose track. I hate to admit it but I prefer to talk to non-stutterers because of this. :(

[happy7117]

to concentrate on what a stutterer is trying to say-- and not what the intended message is... and yes it's mentally to concentrate on what a stutterer is trying to say-- and not what the intended message is... and yes it's mentally For a instant gratification, everything speedy society like us ... yeah I agree.. patience is... um a skill? I met a group of stutterers who were all very interesting people -- more interesting than the fluent people I met in everyday life. BUT I must admit talking to a stutterer made ME feel uncomfortable because you have to pretend to be patient and concentrate more on what they're saying before you lose track. I hate to admit it but I prefer to talk to non-stutterers because of this. :(


Exactly-- it feels as if they are pretending to
listen when they really do
not know what the heck a
stutterer is saying- so they have
to concentrate on what a stutterer is trying to say-- and not what the intended message is... and yes it's mentally exausting for the listener as well.
. and as a stutterer myself, I feel the same way a average non stutter does listening to a stutter..
In fact-- I kind of "zone out"(yeah it's rude I know)--
as a stutterer is talking-- the stutter detracts from the message trying to be said-- so the listener
kind of passively waits nicely but impatiently
to words that are not understood[LEFT]]

[marcopolo]

I agree..it is expensive... I'm actually bidding on a cheap pocket pc/telephone with mobile windows 2003 so I can test the mobile version of the software I have on my PC.. Will let you guys know it it works while on the phone through the unit.

Looking forward to hear results with Propranolol... Good luck...

Well got the ipaq pocket pc 6315. It also a phone with tmobile. the software does not work well while on the phone as I hoped. I just use it without the phone on the road in my car while talking on my other cell. Oh well...

Good luck to all..
\Marco

[Jamus]

Delayed auditory feedback (DAF) delays your voice to your ears a fraction of a second. It give you the illusion that you are talking in unison with another person...

I use a headset with one ear that also has a microphone. this connects to my pc that runs the software and I simply use the phone on the free ear.
here is a link...http://www.artefactsoft.com/daf.htm

I have found a DAF unit called Telephone Fluency System that is made from casa futura. I found a site that sells it for 495. Thinking of getting it because you use both your ears in the delay and can plug it into the phone and hear the callers voice as well while the caller hears no delay...

Found this in the back logs. It's a program you install and can use online. I believe it's exactly like the SpeechEasy device. You can practice it online by yourself or with others next to you in person, or practice with it talking on the phone if you have a headset. Only problem is you can't bring it with you out in public (unless you have a cell phone or other device to plug it into and have a mini wireless mic to stick into your ear :rolleyes:

It is very cool! I've always to try it but not go through the hassle of going through the speecheasy stuff.

[chrondog06]

I've tried Paxil with no impovement in stuttering. Paxil pretty much effects the Serotonin levels in the brain and not Dopamine. I then tried Buspar and Inderal with no improvement at all. I finally tried Xanax XR 1mg(generic is Alprazolam). All i can say is wow. What a difference it made for me. Xanax lowers the Dopamine and GABA levels in the brain. Pagoclone works pretty much the same way but w/out the side effects and possible addiction problems. Xanax is a Benzo drug so it can be addicting if taken in high doses over a long period. I've been taking Xanax XR 1mg for 2 years now. I would say it's improved my fluency a good 80-90%. It helps alot with the phone calls I must take for my job. Slows down my speech enough for my brain to catch up. If/when Pagoclone ever gets FDA approval, I will definitely try that.

[Paranoid]

Found this in the back logs. It's a program you install and can use online. I believe it's exactly like the SpeechEasy device. You can practice it online by yourself or with others next to you in person, or practice with it talking on the phone if you have a headset. Only problem is you can't bring it with you out in public (unless you have a cell phone or other device to plug it into and have a mini wireless mic to stick into your ear :rolleyes:

It is very cool! I've always to try it but not go through the hassle of going through the speecheasy stuff.

I wouldn't really call the (fluency master) a hassle. You go to a professional audiologist, get an ear impression done. Secondly, you ship the ear mold to the lab directed by (fluency master), wait for it to come back to you and then arrange an appointment to try the device. Aside from the driving down to the States part the only real "hassle" is the four grand you're forkin over for the damn thing. therapy and natural progression, I want my quick fix!

[Jamus]

I wouldn't really call the (fluency master) a hassle. You go to a professional audiologist, get an ear impression done. Secondly, you ship the ear mold to the lab directed by (fluency master), wait for it to come back to you and then arrange an appointment to try the device. Aside from the driving down to the States part the only real "hassle" is the four grand you're forkin over for the damn thing. therapy and natural progression, I want my quick fix!

lol. Maybe it's just me, but I see all that as a hassle. And if I'm going to pay anywhere from $4100 to $4900 for it I would expect them to come to my house, fit me with the mold and mail it out all themselves! Then send it to me afterwords. I really expect at least all that if they are going to rob me. Sorry just how I feel.
I'll stick with the at home version, and if it doesnt work for me at home, then I know not to invest in it.

[happy7117]

therapy and natural progression, I want my quick fix!

100% agree. Couldn't of said it more fluently myself.

Oh yeah. Screw Speecheasy. I'll go for the vocal tone amplification caused by the flueny master which is a nightmarish price.

I can't afford it, so needless to say my stuttering is a holy hell. I am so ing angry at the fact I cannot a device.

I am not going to die a stutterer.

I am so pissed at having no money.

[sst]

Happy and Paranoid, your views just aren't rational towards stuttering. Maybe Paranoid was being sarcastic, but I still have a point.

These devices are a ripoff and do not work. I'm sorry, but even if a few people say it helps them, it's just not worth almost $5000 grand for what amounts to some plastic and a microphone. I feel sorry for whoever invests in these things because you might as well just throw your money away.

Most of us don't have that kind of money to spend on things that A.) don't work and B.) even if they offer some small help to the fraction of stutters that have the type of stuttering that it supposedly cures, are cumbersome and not something one can use in the long run.

[Silent]

Happy,

You say screw therapy because there is a quick fix.
But you can't afford the quick fix, so... there is nothing you can do but wait until the circumstances magically change and complain on the board about how unfair this world is.
It must feel good to have an excuse for everything, but this attitude is unlikely to lead you anywhere.

Even if you ever get a SpeechEasy device, how do you know it will work for you? You may have tried it in a 'lab' setting and it may have worked for you... but what if it doesn't in other situations? What if the effect wears off shortly? Disappointment and search for another excuse? Such things work best when combined with other forms of therapy, but you're unwilling to do any.

This also applies to those waiting for Pagoclone to be their savior.

[sst]

Happy,

You say screw therapy because there is a quick fix.
But you can't afford the quick fix, so... there is nothing you can do but wait until the circumstances magically change and complain on the board about how unfair this world is.
It must feel good to have an excuse for everything, but this attitude is unlikely to lead you anywhere.

Even if you ever get a SpeechEasy device, how do you know it will work for you? You may have tried it in a 'lab' setting and it may have worked for you... but what if it doesn't in other situations? What if the effect wears off shortly? Disappointment and search for another excuse? Such things work best when combined with other forms of therapy, but you're unwilling to do any.

This also applies to those waiting for Pagoclone to be their savior.

Silent, I've often said the same thing. Happy won't listen. Some people just can't face reality sometimes. Reality is harsh and it is unfair, but it hurts you more when you set yourself up for disappointment. Which is what he is doing. I don't think anything will deter him from this unattainable goal of getting a stuttering device. If you can't afford to buy it, how will you get it? The stuttering device is out to make money, that's it. They don't have sympathy for us. I doubt they even stutter. Maybe it's time for Happy to find a sugarmama. ;)

I think some people just enjoy having something to complain about. Speech therapy does work, usually, if you put in the effort. It did work for me a long time ago when I did it. But it is expensive, but I at least acknowledge it works.

[Jamus]

This also applies to those waiting for Pagoclone to be their savior.

Exactly. There. Is. No. Quick. Fix. For. Stuttering. So those of you expecting that will be let down in the end. It's time to stop having these grand expectations, and start developing self-disclipline and work on your stutter yourself. Do research, practice talking to yourself a loud or in a mirror. Practice talking to a close friend or family member. Experiment with those B Vitamins. Stop or cut back on the foods that increase Dopamine. Meditate. Etc etc.

Just find something that seems to work for you and stick with it. Have faith in it and don't give up b/c you still stutter a 'day' after trying it. There is no quick fix for fluency that will last in the long run.

[Paranoid]

Frig that, I'm gettin my fluency master...

[sst]

Frig that, I'm gettin my fluency master...

Let us know how you feel after blowing $5000 grand on something that doesn't work. :)

[Silent]

Frig that, I'm gettin my fluency master...
I wish you the best of luck with it.

[happy7117]

For a instant gratification, everything speedy society like us ... yeah I agree.. patience is... um a skill? I met a group of stutterers who were all very interesting people -- more interesting than the fluent people I met in everyday life. BUT I must admit talking to a stutterer made ME feel uncomfortable because you have to pretend to be patient and concentrate more on what they're saying before you lose track. I hate to admit it but I prefer to talk to non-stutterers because of this. :(

I get uncomfortable everytime I stutter. Absolutley right about listeners pretending to be patient. They are waiting for us to say what we clearly cannot say.

I don't blame a listenerer for cutting us off, or talking to someone else. We are exhausting trying to be understood, and it's something that listeners are not used too.

And knowing a person is pretending to be patient when they are not helping us makes the stutter worse than it may already be.

Being patient with a stutterer like me, you, or anyone does NOT promote or make a stutterer's speech easier to understand. If anything, being patient gives this impression to a stutterer: "Go ahead and stutter your brains off while I pretend to wait for you..not knowing what your saying".

Also, your absolutley right about listeners have to strain to be able to understand us.

Listeners are used to getting others messages heard because other's speech is fluent and clear to understand.

With a nasty severe stutterer, a listener has to strain and concentrate on what the stutterer is trying to say. Many are not used to having to strain to try to understand a person who can barely be understood.

The listener ultimately gives up in trying to understand you, and nods their head as though they are listening-when in fact they are not listening to you.
That is another defeat to our self-esteem and that makes us feel shittier about our speech and ourselves.

[happy7117]

Happy,

You say screw therapy because there is a quick fix.
But you can't afford the quick fix, so... there is nothing you can do but wait until the circumstances magically change and complain on the board about how unfair this world is.
It must feel good to have an excuse for everything, but this attitude is unlikely to lead you anywhere.

Even if you ever get a SpeechEasy device, how do you know it will work for you? You may have tried it in a 'lab' setting and it may have worked for you... but what if it doesn't in other situations? What if the effect wears off shortly? Disappointment and search for another excuse? Such things work best when combined with other forms of therapy, but you're unwilling to do any.

This also applies to those waiting for Pagoclone to be their savior.

Unwilling because as I've said in past threads, don't have the money.

Excuses?? Nope. I just tell the truth.

"My dog ate my homework"--that's an excuse!

I don't search for excuses. I tell my situatin like it is.

Quick fix?? There is not supposed to be a quick fix for stuttering, but immediate treatment if it's the right treatment.

Your opinions speak softly but carry a big stick.:rolleyes:

[happy7117]

Silent, I've often said the same thing. Happy won't listen. Some people just can't face reality sometimes. Reality is harsh and it is unfair, but it hurts you more when you set yourself up for disappointment. Which is what he is doing. I don't think anything will deter him from this unattainable goal of getting a stuttering device. If you can't afford to buy it, how will you get it? The stuttering device is out to make money, that's it. They don't have sympathy for us. I doubt they even stutter. Maybe it's time for Happy to find a sugarmama. ;)

I think some people just enjoy having something to complain about. Speech therapy does work, usually, if you put in the effort. It did work for me a long time ago when I did it. But it is expensive, but I at least acknowledge it works.

Reality is the fact I stutter and will always will. Relality is I need to accept I don't have the money to afford the device. Reality is I don't have enough money to pay for therapy.

What does a stutterer do when a stutterer has not enough money even with a good paying job like me?

The devices are out to help people. If devices did not work or were innefective, they would not be sold.

For the devices that don't work for the stutterer, it's the wrong kind of device.

If sellers are out to dupe us, they should be in prison and should not be selling something that will not help us.

Pardon me, but what is a sugarmama??

Therapy has failed me in the past- I worked my tail off, but it did not work in the real world.

I guess i never reminded others about when I totaly relapsed 4 months after I got home from a 4 week therapy program back in the summer of 1996??

Hit rock bottom..therapy since them has only worked in the therapy room, but outside therapy is nill..

I have worked my tail off trying to implement what was learned in the therapy room outside, and it was almost impossible...

[happy7117]

Let us know how you feel after blowing $5000 grand on something that doesn't work. :)

Fluency Master maybe did not work for you because you did not have the kind of stuttering the fluency master works with to help. For Paranoid, maybe DAF/FAF did not help like it did not help me.

He's looking for vocal tone amplification which the fluency master provides. I say, your the man Paranoid. Don't let others deter you! You do what you think is ight, and you follow your instincts.

If he has the money and has faith--I have nothing but the best of hope for him!!

I would love for him to be smooth as silk when it works.

If I had 5 grand, I would be right there with you!!

[happy7117]

Frig that, I'm gettin my fluency master...

I have nothing but the best of luck for you. A man after my own heart or would that be regular normal sounding speech?! Enjoy releif from the F:) M. It's about time you got a break from stuttering.:D

[sst]

The devices are out to help people. If devices did not work or were innefective, they would not be sold.

If sellers are out to dupe us, they should be in prison and should not be selling something that will not help us.

Pardon me, but what is a sugarmama??

As far as I know, stuttering devices are not endorsed by any reputable medical organization. The sad fact of the matter is a lot of people in this country like to make money by taking advantaged of the weak, the poor, the disadvantaged, and even the stutterers. Just look at news headlines about people losing their savings and their houses. It's a scary time right now. But we as stutterers are not immune to being ripped off and taken advantage of. They know we have lived very scary, lonely, and depressing lives and get fed up with it. I know how you feel Happy, I'm at my wit's end too. It sucks. But what sucks more is being taken advantage of.

A sugarmama? Well it's an old lady with lots of money, whom you offer "services" to in exchange for a long-term relationship. It's kind of like whoring yourself out, hehe. :o I don't think you're that kind of person, though.


Fluency Master maybe did not work for you because you did not have the kind of stuttering the fluency master works with to help. For Paranoid, maybe DAF/FAF did not help like it did not help me.

He's looking for vocal tone amplification which the fluency master provides. I say, your the man Paranoid. Don't let others deter you! You do what you think is ight, and you follow your instincts.

I've never had a stuttering device, and I'm not interested in getting one. I don't like wasting my money on uncertain things. If Paranoid getting a stuttering device empowers him and makes him feel better, more power to him. Maybe just feeling empowered will make his fluency better. I understand where you and Paranoid come from, but I'm not one to make risky decisions if I can help it. I've learned my lessons.

[Silent]

Unwilling because as I've said in past threads, don't have the money.
There are things you can do that don't take a lot of money. However, they may take an open mind.

No one knows what will work for you. But if you try all you can instead of waiting idly, you will learn plenty and the image will become clearer, which may help you maintain your fluency when you finally get your device.

Not an easy path for sure... Just my 2 cents, take it for what it's worth.

[Paranoid]

Happy...

Thanks for the kind words... I wish more of these personalities made sense like you... as for letting people deter me, oh dont worry about that... I'll bust 'em up hehe

[happy7117]

As far as I know, stuttering devices are not endorsed by any reputable medical organization. The sad fact of the matter is a lot of people in this country like to make money by taking advantaged of the weak, the poor, the disadvantaged, and even the stutterers. Just look at news headlines about people losing their savings and their houses. It's a scary time right now. But we as stutterers are not immune to being ripped off and taken advantage of. They know we have lived very scary, lonely, and depressing lives and get fed up with it. I know how you feel Happy, I'm at my wit's end too. It sucks. But what sucks more is being taken advantage of..

Let me see if I am hearing you correctly big guy:)

You are at your wit's end and hate stuttering???

But you don't want to get a device because you feel they don't work??

So you would like to live with stuttering which means being misunderstood all your life??

That's your decision, and an option that is all up to you.

I have been living without a device all my life, and have suffered herendously from it, it's the most humiliating embarrassing, angering thing ever knowing I can't talk normaly.

I don't mind SOME dysflueny. But TOTAL disfluency is a nightmare. And If I told myself "screw a device, I will not spend the money" I would feel pretty messed up.

Don't you want to have every oppurtunity to talk normaly or with less trouble like the world does??

If your a mild stutterer with minor trouble, you obviously don't need a device, and don't want a device because your dysfluency is barable and managable without one.


A sugarmama? Well it's an old lady with lots of money, whom you offer "services" to in exchange for a long-term relationship. It's kind of like whoring yourself out, hehe. :o I don't think you're that kind of person, though...

That thought makes me sick:eek:

On the other hand, I have had thoughts of paying a girl or hot girl my age to go out with me. That sounds stupid, but I have asked girls out in the past, and they have said NO of course.

I either get the lame old excuse "I have a boyfriend", or some other way of saying NO while still trying to be nice and polite to me.

My thoughts of "I have a boyfriend" said by a girl I ask out are "bullshit you do", or "let's see him so I know your not brushing me off", or "don't lie to me".

Now had I asked that identical question "Would you like to go out sometime"
and did not stutter, she probably would say "Yes, I'd love to. When".

No doubt it's the stutter B.S that turns chicks off and has them say NO.

And the chicks that do say YES to me for a date, or promise to meet me somewhere for lunch or a drink end up standing me up, or stiffing me.

But if I had money to pay a hot girl to go out with me, they might say OK because they would be getting money out of it, but they would have to go out with me for the money. Money would be the incentive to go out on a date.

It's evil and nasty to have to pay another person to be your date or friend because they may say NO otherwise. But a stutterer who has never dated in their life because of the stuttering shit probably will go to any lengths to get some action.:mad:

[happy7117]

Happy...

Thanks for the kind words... I wish more of these personalities made sense like you... as for letting people deter me, oh dont worry about that... I'll bust 'em up hehe

I'm so glad you and I are on the same page here. I have wanted that dam Fluency Master for 5 yrs. now. What it does based on what the website says is everytime a stutterer talks, it let's out a loud amplified buzz into one's left ear. That amplified buzz hide's the stutterers voice from being able to be heard. It could also be known as the waterfall effect. If you or I spoke against the loud whoosh of a waterfall, we would be clear of stuttering because the waterfall noise would prevent us from hearing our voice.

But I don't have money for the earmold, or the apparatus itself.

I have spoken to the wicked nice Doc named Dr Felixbrod who sells the device. He also has one. He sounds kick butt awesome.

And to those say Speecheasy or Fluency Master don't work or are snake oil, ask Felixbrod who the Flueny Master helps immensely.

I am wicked happy for him, he is my inspiration. But I am envious of him. I want the fluency he has gained from that device.

I almost wish I could rip that thing off his ear and put it in my left ear.

Another way of looking at the Fluency Master is a speech amplifer of the voice. The mini microphine picks up the sound of the stutterer's voice and sends the voice into the left ear through an ear mold.

In all truthfullness, I DID try the FM back in January of 1999, but it did not work for me then. The fluency master only works for those that DAF/FAF does not help. DAF/FAF helped me then at that time because the fluency master did not. I did not have the kind of stuttering the fluency master worked with.

It's been 9 years since then and my stutter has gotten tremendously worse, and DAF/FAF has not worked for me. So I desperately need to to go back to be fitted for the fluency master, but I don't have the $5000.

My father was being an asshole about it too. As many times as I have explained that I desperately need to be refiited for a Fluency Master because that would benefit me greatly, he says "Absolutlely not. It didn't work for you last time, so we are not going to spend another $3,000 on it"

In other words, my folks are not willing to spend money that could benefit me and my speech on the right device, but they sure are willing to listen to incomprehensable crap and then wonder why I get into mood swings where I don't clean the apartment, or get easily pissed and impatient when I stutter a ton.

I'm glad my father is not reading this post, he would be so red. At least he's getting a fluent earfull. If I were to read this post out verbally to him, it would be an incomprehensable stuttered mess.

This smilie is for you Pops:mad: :p

[Silent]

In all truthfullness, I DID try the FM back in January of 1999, but it did not work for me then. The fluency master only works for those that DAF/FAF does not help. DAF/FAF helped me then at that time because the fluency master did not.
So you have never experienced the FM work for you, but you assume it will because DAF/FAF no longer does?

Well, that it only works for those that DAF/FAF doesn't help, doesn't mean it works for all of them.

My father was being an asshole about it too.
Maybe your dad too should call you an asshole just because you don't buy him things he wants for your hard-earned money...

[Silent]

What does a stutterer do when a stutterer has not enough money even with a good paying job like me?
If you can't shell out the mere $5000 despite having a good paying job, I suggest you stop paying the outrageous rent to your greedy parents and seek a cheaper place to live. A nice extra is that you won't have to clean their apartment anymore :)

[happy7117]

So you have never experienced the FM work for you, but you assume it will because DAF/FAF no longer does?...

DAF/FAF no longer works for me. Therapy never did either even after working at it. FM may have a much better chance of working for me since it works with vocal tone unlike DAF/FAF.

If something does not work, we should try something else.

Maybe your dad too should call you an asshole just because you don't buy him things he wants for your hard-earned money...

The word "asshole" may have been a strong word but when I'm mad, I use obscenities:mad: I like extremely unfair better I think because it sounds cleaner. And that's why I wish we could edit posts after we post them. I could have made a word switch to sound less harsh.

I have sweared a couple times on here, but that's out of anger and frusteration over the stutter-stuff.

He was being extremely unfair not because he wasn't going to spend all that money on the FM, but because he said "You are never going to try the Fluency Master again because it did not work the first time".

In his mind if something fails the first time, it never is to be tried again. Bad attitude to have. I wonder if he ever realized that people change over time?? I mean that day when I tried the Fluency Master was 9 yrs. ago.

My stutter has obviously gotten tremendously worse since then, and he is being unfair to me by not letting me try the FM just because it did not help the 1st time.

About the a-hole word. My pop has called me an ass or an a-hole before!! If he called me an a-hole I probably would tell him to leave the apartment, and come back later when he's cooled off!!

Something weird though- I get p-'d off, I have no trouble talking.

[happy7117]

If you can't shell out the mere $5000 despite having a good paying job, I suggest you stop paying the outrageous rent to your greedy parents and seek a cheaper place to live. A nice extra is that you won't have to clean their apartment anymore :)

I have my own apartment, and Social security pays my rent.

If my paycheck from work did not have to go towards bills, I could save up for device.

I can't produce $5000 out of my pocket any time I want.:D

[Paranoid]

Yeah Happy, about the girl thing... I know where you're comin from, I met my first girlfriend through the internet :D , its tough for a stuttering dude to just walk up to a good lookin gal and start talkin, too much friggin pressure. Maybe after like three beers and two whiskeys when my brain is all nice and soaked but otherwise its a definitely a no go! unwanted anxiety! thats why i try and steer clear from the snobby high maintenance types. I prefer cougars :p

[happy7117]

Yeah Happy, about the girl thing... I know where you're comin from, I met my first girlfriend through the internet :D , its tough for a stuttering dude to just walk up to a good lookin gal and start talkin, too much friggin pressure.

I know where your coming from. I met my first girlfriend online back in '96 when I was in 10th grade. She was from Massachussets. We immediately hit it off online. When the time came for me to call her for the first time, I was a stuttering wreck. Needless to say, I never called her again because of that.

Yeah, I look checking out babes, but the humilating part is chatting up a chick without sounding like a jack-ass.

Girls hate boys who can barely talk.

Getting big muscles may make a guy more fit and attractive to a hottie, but the girl still will be turned off if the man can barely spit out words like saliva.